Transcript of the meeting:

Vladimir Putin: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. I will not speak about the Interior Ministry reform today. It is a subject that has been discussed at length, much has been written about it and there have been many disputes. All of us know why the reform was launched in the first place and what its goals are. I will only say that your profession is vitally important to the country and the nation, and is also very complex. It is complex because it involves working with people, and also because people judge the government’s efficiency by the results of your work and your methods. It is complex because the conditions in which we live and you work are sometimes dangerous. The recent events on the border between Dagestan and Chechnya, where your comrades, officers of the Interior Ministry, have died, are the latest proof of this. But you made the right choice when you decided to devote your lives to serving your homeland, the country and its people.

But at this meeting in Barnaul I would like to speak above all about the social aspects of your service. I want to know if you have benefited from our decisions in the social sphere regarding the increase in remuneration. I see law enforcement veterans in this room – have your pensions and other allowances, including payments for occupational diseases, been raised? Have our decisions regarding housing benefited you? I will gladly answer all your questions – I am sure that you have many. I suggest that we conduct this meeting in a relaxed and informal manner.

Colleagues, who will be the first to speak?

Svetlana Perova (head of the Interior Ministry department on the financial and economic policy and social guarantees): I am Svetlana Perova, head of the financial department. I will probably express the opinion of everyone in this room and all Interior Ministry officers who are grateful to you for your personal assistance to the Interior Ministry agencies, in particular material and technical assistance, as well as for the social benefits which we will discuss today.

I would like to report to you that, acting in accordance with your instructions, we monitored the payment of remuneration at all Interior Ministry organisations and divisions in all Russian regions in January. We can say that the planned targets have been achieved. A new system, a new structure of monetary remuneration has been created. It is based on the basic salary and the rank pay grade, which account for half of the remuneration. Rank payments have grown 300% on average, and monetary remuneration as a whole has doubled across the country.

However, our monitoring has shown that there are some categories of employees whose remuneration has not grown accordingly. These are mostly top officials, who received substantial pay raises in the past, such as heads of territorial police agencies, some categories of the OMON and OMSN special police units, and our criminal investigation departments. Seeking to resolve this issue and ensure proper balance, we have amended the documents and departmental orders, which have been signed so that we will now work with due account of the new regulations.

Unfortunately, we don’t have the same opportunities as you, Mr Putin, because of certain limitations. Our wage fund consists of basic payments, rank payments and fixed compensation incentive payments. They make up about 90% of the wage fund, which means that we can make amendments only within these limits. As for additional payments – for hazardous working conditions, for special services and for risk, they account for about 8.5% of the wage fund, or 46 billion roubles. As you know, we have increased the remuneration of police officers in Moscow and the Moscow Region for dangerous service conditions, in accordance with the presidential instruction.

Vladimir Putin: By 10%, if memory serves?

Svetlana Perova: That’s right, by 10%, which brought the figure to 65,000 a month in Moscow and 60,000 in the Moscow Region, so our resources are not very extensive. Naturally, to even out the financial support for the different categories, we would ask you to issue another mandate for us to consider this issue further along with the Finance Ministry and scrape together some additional financial resources for 2012 if possible.

We have monitored the implementation of the earlier decision – the regional bonuses to transport police officers. They are not paid in the regions, I mean as incentives. The decision was made in Moscow and the Moscow Region, but local transport police officers are not getting anything. Policemen in Khanty-Mansiysk and the Yamal-Nenets Autonomous Area saw a small pay rise. A bill should be drafted, as part of the instruction also issued by the president, which would authorise regional leaders to pay these bonuses, if possible.

I know that in the Altai Territory, district police officers received a monthly bonus of 1,000 roubles, and it was paid as an incentive.

Vladimir Putin: I will answer your question in a moment. Let’s hear the inspectors first, and then I will return to the point you were making.

Kristina Archibasova (truant officer): Mr Putin, my name is Kristina Archibasova and I am a truant officer. In January, police officers received a good pay increase…

Vladimir Putin: Do you work already?

Kristina Archibasova: Yes.

Vladimir Putin: You aren’t a university student, are you?

Kristina Archibasova: I graduated from the Barnaul Law School in August 2011.

Vladimir Putin: So you work here in Barnaul?

Kristina Archibasova: Yes, I mean I was placed in this position after graduation and began working as a truant officer in September.

Vladimir Putin: How many charges do you have?

Kristina Archibasova: How many kids? We have as many as 256 in the Indusrialny District.

Vladimir Putin: Is that where you work, the Industrialny District?

Kristina Archibasova: Right. Police Department No. 2.

Vladimir Putin: Are you satisfied with the working conditions?

Kristina Archibasova: Yes, completely. They are entirely normal.

Vladimir Putin: What do you mean by normal? What is it like there?

Kristina Archibasova: As a place of work, there are no problems at all. When I came to the office on my first day as a new employee, I was immediately given a desk.

Vladimir Putin: What about the room? Is it in a good condition? In good repair? There are no leaks or drafts? Are you warm enough there?

Kristina Archibasova: No, there are definitely no leaks. And we are warm. It’s good. They showed me right away what my job would be and gave me all the files for problem children. I mean those registered proactively with the department. So I found myself in action on my first day.

Vladimir Putin: How many charges did you say you have? Two hundred and…?

Kristina Archibasova: Two hundred fifty six, in the entire district.

Vladimir Putin: And you have to take care of all of them personally?

Kristina Archibasova: No, I have my own group which is far smaller.

Vladimir Putin: That’s what I am asking you. How big is your group?

Kristina Archibasova: I have nine minors registered.

Vladimir Putin: Nine?

Kristina Archibasova: Yes. You're wondering why only nine? I have the smallest number of charges in our department, probably because I am responsible for an area that is a new development and it is considered to be more well-off. It is clean and well cared for, and one can tell it is high-class just by looking at the local school and local people…

Vladimir Putin: Do you mean the residents there receive a higher-income, and there are higher living standards?

Kristina Archibasova: Yes.

Vladimir Putin: I see.

Kristina Archibasova: The buildings are all new, and new housing is not something many people can afford. It is a newly developed area, as I said, and one can easily see the difference between the central area and remote parts.

Vladimir Putin: How old are your charges, on average?

Kristina Archibasova: They are all under 18 of course, and most of them are 14. They are badly in need of control at this particular age, because they are still…

Vladimir Putin: Is there no one to control them except you? Why do they need you so much? What is happening to them? Can’t their parents get them under control? What kind of families are they from?

Kristina Archibasova: If their parents could do that, we wouldn’t have had to intervene. To get their name registered with a police office, minors either have to demonstrate anti-social behavior or commit a crime before they come of age, that is, there must be something going on. If they are simply truants, or have problems at school, we do not register them, although we plan regular activities for them, too. As a school inspector, I visit schools at least twice. We discuss things with them, or give lectures on specific issues and proper behavior, trying to keep them from committing offences and crimes.

Vladimir Putin: Is there a chance that they will improve?

Kristina Archibasova: There certainly is, I think. Otherwise, what are we doing there?

Vladimir Putin: Do you truly care about them?

Kristina Archibasova: Of course I do. How else could I feel? I always try to reach some understanding, so that they won’t look at me as a uniformed officer, but rather as a friend – as someone they can trust. It often happens that they cannot confide in their parents or are afraid of telling them something. So they come to us. We call them our kids. Sometimes they just come to visit.

Vladimir Putin: And they are not afraid of your uniforms?

Kristina Archibasova: Our uniforms? Not that I have noticed. I think they like them. To the contrary, they seem to have shown more interest now that the changes have taken place.

Vladimir Putin: Do you, and the others, like your new uniforms?

Kristina Archibasova: We certainly do. We received them only recently. They are much lighter, because the fabric of the old uniforms was just very heavy and thick. We are waiting for summer, because it will be much easier in the new uniforms in warm weather.

Vladimir Putin: So, what did you want to ask?

Kristina Archibasova: First, as I said, our pay has been increased. We would like to thank the country’s leadership for their attention and care. On the other hand, everyone knows that money is losing value due to inflation. Mr Putin, what do you plan for the future? Will our wages be indexed to the inflation rate or will there be fixed additional payments?

Vladimir Putin: In accordance with current legislation and the new law, payments will be adjusted for the inflation rate each year. Judging by preliminary calculations – these are preliminary calculations – we expect inflation to be at about 6% next year. I’d like to remind you, it was 6.1% last year, in 2011, the lowest figure for 20 years. I am not sure that we can keep inflation at this level next year, even though the target figure is 6%. But it may go up a little due to a number of objective factors. However, we obviously will try to keep it as low as possible. Remuneration will be adjusted to the target inflation rate, so you don’t need to worry. Okay, guys, are there any more questions?

Maxim Sergeyev (senior lieutenant, investigating officer at the special investigations unit): May I?

Vladimir Putin: Yes, go ahead.

Maxim Sergeyev: I am Maxim Sergeyev, an investigating officer from the special investigations unit. I have a question which interests many police officers. The new legislation has given police officers the opportunity to acquire housing using the so-called one-off social payment. I have worked in the police for just over nine years, and so I am ineligible to receive a flat using this system in 2012 because I have less than 10 years’ service. So, I want to ask how long this programme will continue to run.

Vladimir Putin: Do you have a specific area of expertise or are you, so to speak, a general specialist?

Maxim Sergeyev: No, we only deal with specific areas. For example, my department is responsible for banditry and organised criminal groups, so we are dealing with very serious crimes.

Vladimir Putin: My word. Yes, that is a serious business. Have any of the cases you passed on to the courts resulted in convictions?

Maxim Sergeyev: Yes, of course. This year I forwarded a case under Article 209 (banditry), which is currently being heard. Last year I completed and passed a similar case on to the court. A guilty verdict was returned under Article 209.

Vladimir Putin: Do you have a degree in jurisprudence or something more specific?

Maxim Sergeyev: Yes, my specialty is law enforcement.

Vladimir Putin: Law enforcement? Have you graduated from this institute too?

Maxim Sergeyev: Yes, I started working in 2006 and graduated in February 2007 with a degree in law enforcement.

Vladimir Putin: I see. Let’s get back to your question. We all know that unlike the military, police officers live in the same city all their lives. All people in Russia have housing problems, but servicemen have it hardest because they constantly have to move from place to place. We are all adults, we know what this entails. People say that two relocations are like one fire. I have experienced it myself. I used to be a serviceman and worked abroad. I saw how servicemen act in these situations: they just heap their belongings into a container and then find out that half of them are missing at the other end. And they often don’t know where to send the container because they are not allocated housing immediately. This is why we addressed the issue of housing for Defence Ministry servicemen as a matter of priority. And we are still working on it.

But housing is an acute problem in the Interior Ministry, too, as we know very well, which is why we need to deal with this issue on several fronts. We are doing this. Our efforts include purchasing service housing, offering the ability to rent housing, and to receive the one-off payment which you mentioned. This one-off social payment is available to those who have served in the Interior Ministry agencies for at least 10 years. This year, as Mr Nurgaliyev (Interior Minister Rashid Nurgaliyev) will tell you, we will allocate about 5 billion roubles – to be exact 4.88 billion – for such one-off social payments to purchase housing. No decision for next year has been made yet, but we will bear in mind that we need to make provision for this in the budget. We have not yet outlined next year’s budget; we have only just started working on it, but we will keep this provision. I hope very much that relevant allocations will also be made next year, when you become eligible for this housing allowance. Thank you.

Next question.

Alexander Vyatkin (retired police lieutenant colonel and Chairman of the Altai Territory Council of Law Enforcement Veterans): My name is Alexander Vyatkin. Mr Putin, I would like to thank you on behalf of veterans and retired officers for the generous pension increase. Veterans are very pleased about it. I served in the police all my life and don’t remember such an increase in pensions for a very long time, both in Altai and across Russia. The pensions have really increased, and they have increased as promised.

I have talked with my former colleagues and they are all very pleased about it. Recently we travelled across one third of the region and met with retired officers and the pension issue came up on many occasions. They are, of course, happy with the current level of payments, although they still have questions, but that is to be expected.

I would like to touch on an issue that is of interest not only to us but to the entire country. Our veterans’ organisation often receives inquiries from widows, families of deceased officers, and the disabled who acquired their disability during service, all saying that their pensions have not been increased. Mr Putin, I would like to ask for your cooperation in addressing this matter, as it is very serious.

Vladimir Putin: It is, Mr Vyatkin, you are absolutely right, this aspect of the issue was overlooked when we worked on this reform. The reason is that pensions are calculated according to a reduction factor as follows: service pay minus 54. We should have reviewed the allowances for the people entitled to compensation for the loss of a breadwinner or due to a disability or occupational disease. This must be changed – because the initial payment is low in the first place and if we deduct 54 it will be literally tiny. Therefore, now we are considering amendments to the reduction factor for those entitled to compensation for the loss of a breadwinner. It may be changed from 30 to 40, or even from 40 to 50, if I’m not mistaken.

Remark: The compensation must be increased.

Vladimir Putin: That’s right. I think it is between 30 and 50. I believe the rate for those entitled to disability compensation will also be changed to from 30 to 40. This decision will be finalised. Before it is finalised – the government has already resolved to maintain pension payments at the level equal to the 2011 level, to avoid any decreases. We will review the payments afterwards and the pensions will be increased for both these categories.

Alexander Vyatkin: Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: Who else would like to speak?

Dmitry Zatsepin (Senior Lieutenant, duty officer of a detached traffic police battalion): May I say a few words, Mr Putin?

Vladimir Putin: Please.

Dmitry Zatsepin: My name is Dmitry Zatsepin, I'm a duty officer who responds to road accidents. I would like to ask you another question on the housing issue. In your recent speech, you raised the issue of the need to draft an affordable mortgage programme for public sector employees. If I’m not mistaken, this implied a 4% annual interest. What particular category of public sector employees did you mean? Did you mean law enforcement officers in general or police officers in particular? Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: We have now established an affordable mortgage system for military personnel within the Defence Ministry. No such system was drafted for the Interior Ministry. But, technically speaking, we can also think about this. Sources of funding are the main issue. I repeat: we proceed from the fact that Interior Ministry officers live in one and the same region, and they don’t move from place to place. But when we talk about soft loans, of course, we mean young families above all.

Mr Zatsepin, you obviously fit into this category. I don’t see why we cannot promote similar affordable mortgage systems within the Interior Ministry. Technically speaking, it is possible to work out an affordable accumulation system for all Interior Ministry officers and to modernise it slightly year after year. We should modernise the relevant system that is being stipulated for the Defence Ministry, but, on the whole, we can think about this. It is obvious that this, of course, can be done for young specialists and young families inside the Interior Ministry, including police. Mr Karlin, you probably have these systems for young families, right?

Alexander Karlin (Governor of the Altai Territory): Yes, Mr Putin.

Vladimir Putin: Virtually in every Russian region.

Alexander Karlin: For instance, we are actively implementing the Young Family programme. With this in mind, I would like to say a few words and thank our federal agencies and the government. Mr Putin, we hold the first place in the country in terms of budgetary funding for the Young Family programme. Last year, we provided state support to 1,807 young families in the Altai Territory under this programme. Federal funding exceeded 400 million roubles. Add to this our regional and municipal allocations. Overall support for this category of families totaled about a billion roubles.

Vladimir Putin: The law does not forbid the use of these federal allocations for supporting employees…  

Alexander Karlin: No Mr Putin, this is not forbidden. We have passed a regional document which, hopefully, does not run counter to the law, and we have defined the categories of professionals fulfilling the most important social functions. Such professionals have priority rights to receive state support if they fit into the young family category. We also provide such support to police officers and Interior Ministry personnel.

Vladimir Putin: Do you mean that they also fall into this list?

Alexander Karlin: Yes.

Vladimir Putin: Along what channels are you implementing this? Do you subsidise loan rates, the down payment, and so on?

Alexander Karlin: It consists of support from three budgetary sources. The total volume of such support depends on the members of a specific family. If a young family has three children, then overall support from federal, regional and municipal budgets consists of 850,000-900,000 roubles. A young family with no children or one child receives somewhat less support which, as a rule, does not fall below 350,000 roubles. This is the cost of the certificate for a young family, and it counts against the housing payment. What is not covered by the certificate through various schemes, including mortgages, is the other side of the matter.

Vladimir Putin: In many regions, when a second child or more children are born in the family, regional administrations pay off part of the primary loan. As far as I remember, in certain regions, when the third child is born, loans are paid off in full. This is a very good policy, Mr Karlin.

Alexander Karlin: Mr Putin, we are aware of these activities, and to some extent even envious of them. We are boosting our budget revenue, including for the regional budget, to make such schemes work. We are aware of them and will make efforts to implement them.

Vladimir Putin: In any case, the personnel of the Interior Ministry are covered by these schemes.

Stanislav Onishchenko (senior district officer, police captain): Mr Putin, I am Stanislav Onishchenko, senior district officer at police unit 7. Under the Federal Law on Police, I have been provided with service housing. I would like to ask you: If I am reassigned and my place of residence changes…

Vladimir Putin: Where would you leave Barnaul for? This is such a good city.

Stanislav Onishchenko: The question is, will I be provided with a service apartment in another region?

Vladimir Putin: Under the law which you have mentioned, you will be provided with service housing within six months. If local authorities do not have such resources, they are to rent a flat for you.  

Stanislav Onishchenko: Thank you.

Renat Timerzyanov (head of the Chief Department of the Interior Ministry in the Altai Territory, police major general): Mr Putin, may I have a word?

Vladimir Putin: Please.

Renat Timerzyanov: Regarding service housing... The problem does exist, and I would like you to pay attention and give your support in this regard. Particularly, for instance, the issue of service housing for district police officers, which has been mentioned here. The law says six months, that’s true. As for general terms for other service housing – we have pricing rates, and the Ministry of Regional Development currently determines the sum to be allocated for the purpose every three months. Sadly, as always happens, this sum – for instance, a sum of 27,050 was determined for the Altai Territory for the 4th quarter of 2012 – is smaller than the range of actual prices. The minimum price for housing, even with shell and core finish, is 30,000 rubles minimum – and our sums do not correspond to these prices. I would like to ask your assistance in settling this issue. One option is for us to take sums that would correspond to the minimum price within these limits – I know that this issue has been solved in certain federal agencies.   

Vladimir Putin: In certain federal agencies it is done this way: if a person exceeds this limit and wants to rent a flat bigger than determined by the limit, he personally pays the remaining sum to the Defence Ministry. In general, as far as I know, I have spoken with officers – I regularly meet with them – and they seem to be satisfied with it. Once their monetary allowances are raised, they are prepared to do this if they want to rent a bigger flat. But is it possible to change the order under which such bigger service flats, which exceed the standards, can be provided for police personnel? It is, but it will result in less housing and less willingness to stay within the limits, that’s it. We could consider this. 

Renat Timerzyanov: I beg your pardon, but the question concerns a slightly different thing – not the regulations on square metres but the price. Currently, one square metre costs 30 or more.

Vladimir Putin: I understand, but in the end it all boils down to what I said. I am perfectly aware of what you are saying. Do you think it is the first time I have heard this? I regularly engage in such issues, every other day.  

Renat Timerzyanov: This is the concept of service housing, right? And whether we want it or not, but today in accordance with all requirements the rotation in the Interior Ministry is well underway.  

Vladimir Putin: I understand. I understand all this. The question is, can we? Sure, we are paying attention to this issue. The price per square metre is increasing together with inflation. But, as the contractor is implementing work under a state order, this means that they are responsible for this particular order, and they have to maintain a certain price. But, once the prices are loosened… We know what the market is – you give them a finger and they’ll take the whole arm. Actions here have to be taken very cautiously, as anything is possible. Mr Nurgaliyev and I will keep this issue under our supervision together with your economic services.  

Renat Timerzyanov: Will you allow me one more question?

Vladimir Putin: Go ahead.

Renat Timerzyanov: It has to do with financial support. I have worked at law-enforcement agencies for a long time and we have always enjoyed support from local and regional bodies. The new Law on Police allows for this as well, and we have the right to use…

Vladimir Putin: What support are you talking about? There are many types of support. Which exactly do you have in mind?

Renat Timerzyanov: I’m referring to the funding of specific targeted programmes on crime prevention and control and traffic safety. Our different agencies have received financial support and, as Ms Perova said, payments have been made to a specific category of our employees. In principle, this is allowed, but there is no mechanism for making such payments. And, in fact, when it comes to the regions…

Vladimir Putin: Let me explain this. Not everything you have mentioned is allowed. Some payments are not allowed and this is the root of the problem. And this is why (as Ms Perova rightly noted) employees of law-enforcement bodies had problems in Moscow, the Moscow Region and in the north – in the Yamal-Nenets and Khanty-Mansi autonomous areas. They also received pay increases but not by double, as was the case with the national average, but by about 50%. In principle, this is also a substantial increase, but it is below what people expected. We could not even make up for this difference by paying 10% from the federal budget for higher salaries in these categories, that is, for employees of law-enforcement bodies in these territories. This was not enough to match the increase to the national average.

Now we are drafting amendments to the current legislation, in particular, to the Law on Police, to allow the regions that wish to do so (and this includes many regions) to continue making these additional payments. In this way the salaries in Moscow, the Moscow Region and in the Yamal-Nenets and Khanty-Mansi autonomous areas will match the national average. We will do this in the near future – make an amendment to the current law. This is the first part of the question.

The second part has to do with material and technical support. Here the local government bodies, or, to be precise, the regional authorities have the right to support local law-enforcement agencies, as it was in the past. Nobody has deprived them of this right. Two options are available here. The first one – regional government bodies can buy some property or transfer it (they can rent it or provide it free of charge) to their law-enforcement agencies. The second option allows them to grant a subsidy from the federal budget. As a rule, the federal budget grants this subsidy but technically the regional bodies can legalise this support by registering it as a federal budget subsidy. Mr Karlin surely knows about this. Do you, Mr Karlin?

Alexander Karlin: Yes, Mr Putin. I’d like to assure you that after the adoption of a package of laws on reforms in the Interior Ministry system and the Law on Police and the Law on the Service in Law-Enforcement Bodies, we have not reduced funding on a single programme. We have three special regional programmes that are aimed at crime prevention and control. But we also have 20 regional programmes that may be characterised as socio-economic ones. We deliberately included into them measures that have direct impact on the crime rate.

Mr Timerzyanov spoke about the resolution of a number of issues. Mr Putin, I’d like to touch upon one subject. I hope Mr Timerzyanov, who visited these facilities, will support me. We have launched a very interesting project – construction of office flats for local police officers. In reality, this is…

Vladimir Putin: This is exactly what they need – to live where they work! This will be a real gift to them. Their wives will be angry. Instead of receiving guests, they will have to see…

Alexander Karlin: The minister has approved this.

Vladimir Putin: Of course, the minister has approved this. Their charges will come…

Alexander Karlin: This is an interesting idea and people feel very good about it because…

Vladimir Putin: And what about policemen themselves?  Do they want to live where they work?

Alexander Karlin: At least in those places where we have… These are flats with all modern conveniences. We have picked up those who want…

Vladimir Putin: Mr Karlin, I understand when such a programme is carried out for general practitioners. They can live and work in the same place because people visit them when they are in trouble. But what will happen with your case?

Alexander Karlin: And this is social emergency aid provided by the police, Mr Putin.

Vladimir Putin: I don’t know; you must know better. You can consult the ministry…

Alexander Karlin: We are discussing this issue with the ministry now. Municipal bodies must provide working premises for local police inspectors, whereas service housing is a different issue, a different mandate, so to speak.

Vladimir Putin: Mr Karlin, it is up to you to decide. You should resolve it as you think is necessary with the Interior Ministry and the regional officials from the Interior Ministry. If you offered me this job and I became a district police officer I would think twice about living and working in the same place, as this job is quite peculiar. Can you imagine Ms Archibasova (Kristina Archibasova) receiving problem children at home? Can you imagine them coming to see her? One can live somewhere nearby but not in the same place. Look, you shouldn’t cut expenses that are already low.

Alexander Karlin: This is true for villages, often remote villages.

Vladimir Putin: Well… I don’t know. In fact, I understand that you do whatever you can to ensure good living and working conditions.

Alexander Karlin: As far as I can see there is a person who has first-hand experience of this.

Stanislav Onishchenko: I am a pioneer who lives and works in a district police office.

Vladimir Putin: That is why he wants to move to a different place.

Stanislav Onishchenko: I am quite happy with it.

Vladimir Putin: He is happy but he wants to move.

Alexander Karlin: Mr Putin, there is a different issue here. Obviously, he wants to move up the career ladder.

Vladimir Putin: Of course he will argue with the governor but when the minister is sitting in front of him he is happy and healthy and content with everything but he wants to move to a new place. And he wants to know if he will get a place to live.

Mr Timerzyanov, what is your job?

Renat Timerzyanov: I am head of the Altai Territory’s Main Directorate of the Interior Ministry.

Vladimir Putin: So his superiors are present here. And everyone is happy.

Renat Timerzyanov: There are many sides to it, Mr Putin. And there are some positive aspects. I remember that in the Soviet period the situation was the same with district police officers in villages. This situation is similar. But first of all, it is not possible in every village.

Vladimir Putin: Do whatever is convenient for you. If I were a district police officer it would not be comfortable for me to work and live in the same place. Imagine people being brought for inquiries to the same place where one’s family and kids live. Is that acceptable? Think about the people.

Alexander Vyatkin: I have a question.

Vladimir Putin: Please go ahead, Mr Vyatkin.

Alexander Vyatkin: It concerns the same issue, Mr Putin. I understand what it is like to serve in the district police. I know that without district police officers there will be problems. I know how hard it is when only one officer administers two or three villages. I know that in such cases he is very hard to find. What we are talking about could be a way out, for now. If we look at a couple of examples in our territory, it is very convenient for the police when a police officer lives and works in the same district. This is my personal opinion, but that has been my experience.

Vladimir Putin: Mr Vyatkin, it is difficult for me to argue with veterans and generals who are currently serving. If there is no alternative it would still be better than no housing at all. But it seems to me that living and working in different places would be better considering the nature of this work. Any more questions? Please.

Mikhail Khorokhordin (police captain and inspector at the installation security department): Police captain Mikhail Khorokhordin. I work at the Altai Territory extradepartmental security department. Mr Putin, the activities of extradepartmental security units are governed by executive government order No. 1629-r, which lists the installations that are subject to mandatory police protection. This document is new and very important to us, and we have been carrying out this order for two years now. However, we are running into problems related to the physical protection of facilities, mostly because of staff cuts that affected us similarly to other police services.

Vladimir Putin: I see.

Mikhail Khorokhordin: Of course, we can say that much can be done here, but we understand that the best way to go now would be to streamline the list that was approved by your order. They could have guarded their facilities on their own in accordance with the law. Admittedly, certain entities have specialised paramilitary units that could guard the facilities owned by such entities. I’m aware that the Interior Ministry has revised the list of facilities subject to mandatory protection. We have seen the revised list and are looking forward to receiving it in the regions. I have a question: can this list be approved in its revised version? It is taking too long to come to a decision on this issue, and we need to work now, so we need this decision immediately.

Vladimir Putin: Mr Khorokhordin, I apologise for dragging out this decision. Mr Nurgaliyev and I can’t decide on the list. He crossed out everything bearing in mind the staff cuts in this area. He doesn’t want to protect anything, but there are facilities that need your help. I will not list them now. Just two days ago I was looking at the minister’s proposals and, as you may have noticed, certain things have been left on the list, because there are certain critical infrastructure facilities that demand special attention and cannot be transferred over to private security companies. Of course, there must be a balance between the number of facilities that you protect and the staff. I hope that we will be able to finish this work in the near future, and that this list will be finalised. I’m aware of this problem. Allow me to repeat: we come back to this issue on a weekly basis in order to add or remove things from the list. At some point we decided that everything was agreed, but we soon started getting requests from heads of these departments and entities saying that they can’t do without the support of the extradepartmental security guards. They are afraid of some potential glitches. Judging by certain things, it’s difficult not to agree that the decision-making process has been delayed due to the sensitivity of the issue. We will finalise it in the near future.

Dmitry Zatsepin: May I, Mr Putin?

Vladimir Putin: Please go ahead, Mr Zatsepin.

Dmitry Zatsepin: As a follow-up to the discussion of the status of a law-enforcement officer, I have a question about the liability of law enforcement officers. The revised criminal law now includes a provision stating that a premeditated crime committed by an interior employee is an aggravating circumstance. Is this a temporary provision due to the current situation in our country, or will it be later applied to all Russian law enforcement officers? Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: Certainly, this legal provision has to do with the current situation in our country and with the need to increase liability for certain actions. This is about a choice of occupation. I’m referring to certain restrictions that are similarly applied to people who engage in political activities or government work. They must provide information about their household revenue, their relatives and so on.  If someone is reluctant to provide such information, then they should choose some other occupation. If people don’t want to commit themselves to heightened liability for their actions, then they shouldn’t do this kind of work. Society wants to protect itself against dishonest people who could abuse their official position, in this particular case, for personal gain. I don’t think we should keep this provision forever. I hope that such provisions will tend to disappear as time goes by, and that they will be replaced by moral responsibility and moral values.

Please, are there any more questions? Is that all?

Yelena Obolenskaya (deputy head of the investigation department, police captain): May I?

Vladimir Putin: Yes, please, go ahead.

Yelena Obolenskaya: My name is Yelena Obolenskaya, I am deputy head of the investigation department. Mr Putin, could you please tell us about the status of the decision regarding changes to the criminal procedure code that involve the introduction of fast-track criminal court proceedings, where preliminary investigation is not required for misdemeanours, and where offenders are known at the beginning of the criminal investigation? In the past, we used to draw up charge sheets, but they are no longer used. What do you think about this?

Vladimir Putin: About what?

Yelena Obolenskaya: About returning to charge sheets and fast-tracking criminal cases in courts.

Vladimir Putin: In general, I’m for it. Certainly, the practice needs to be generalised first. The Interior Ministry, the Prosecutor’s Offices and courts should generalise the experience and provide their recommendations. However, I believe that this is a more comfortable way to work. What do you think, Ms Obolenskaya?

Yelena Obolenskaya: I would like to return to the system of charge sheets.

Vladimir Putin: Well, then we agree. Now, we have to see what recommendations the courts, the Prosecutor General’s Office and the ministry will come up with after summarising the existing practice.

Yelena Obolenskaya: Are you saying that this issue is being worked on now?

Vladimir Putin: Yes.

Yelena Obolenskaya: Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: You’re welcome.

Vitaly Lukin (head of the criminal investigation department, senior police lieutenant): May I, Mr Putin?

Vladimir Putin: Yes, please go ahead.

Vitaly Lukin: My name is Vitaly Lukin. I’m head of the criminal investigation department. Speaking of the unavoidability of punishment, as a law enforcement officer and as a citizen of the Russian Federation, I’m interested in the liberalisation …

Vladimir Putin: In what? Liberalisation?

Vitaly Lukin: Yes. Liberalisation with respect to elements of general criminal and economic offences. With regard to general criminal offences, I’m truly puzzled by this issue in the context of fighting such crimes as drug addiction. Do you think punishment should be toughened or…?

Vladimir Putin: What is your educational background?

Vitaly Lukin: I graduated from the Omsk Academy.

Vladimir Putin: I’m sure that all of you, including myself, have taken a course in criminology. Criminologists should decide on whether society should toughen or soften the punishment for a particular crime. You know and I know that there are certain limits for toughening or softening liability. There should be some middle ground for a particular society at a given point in time. I believe that today, given the huge threat to society posed by illegal drug trafficking, we should toughen liability, not soften it.

Vitaly Lukin: Thank you.

Dmitry Zatsepin: May I, Mr Putin?

Vladimir Putin: Yes, please.

Dmitry Zatsepin: There is an area that can be liberalised. I’m an officer on duty in charge of traffic accidents. My question will be of interest to almost everyone, primarily drivers, vehicle owners and insurance companies. We know that recently, major Russian cities have experienced a spate of small traffic accidents causing material damage. Current traffic rules allow drivers to write up an accident report without waiting for the police. However, drivers are waiving this right – for objective reasons – and they wait for hours for traffic police, which leads to congestion and gridlock. The Russian State Motor Vehicle Inspectorate has raised this issue on many occasions and has spoken with relevant parties, such as the Russian Union of Motor Insurers, human rights activists and associations of motor vehicle owners in order to discuss the issue, but to no avail. I suggest making the paperwork involved in small traffic accidents even more straightforward. I know from my own experience that many such accidents can be written up using so-called euro-protocol.

Vladimir Putin: What is required to make it even more straightforward?

Dmitry Zatsepin: The current damage liability of 25,000 roubles needs to be doubled or even tripled.  

Vladimir Putin: Then more people would be able to use this provision?

Dmitry Zatsepin: Yes, but that's not all there is to it. There’s also a psychological issue…

Vladimir Putin: In other words you suggest making it 50,000 roubles?

Dmitry Zatsepin: Preferably 75,000, because lots of people are buying cars now. I’m sure you are aware of the situation with the car market and of the fact that people are buying lots of good new vehicles.

My second practical proposal has to do with the psychological mindset. Vehicle owners are afraid to do the paperwork involved in traffic accidents themselves. They don’t know how to do it, and they think it’s a complicated procedure. In fact, this is not the case. Perhaps we should teach would-be drivers at driving schools to assess damage and do such paperwork. And they should be able to go and write things up if it’s in line with the traffic rules. There’s nothing complicated about it. I believe that this will improve the driving culture, and accidents will cease to be so stressful. In turn, traffic police will be able to re-direct their forces and material resources to work on bringing down the number of accident-related injuries and deaths. I believe that this is fully in line with the latest reforms in the sphere of traffic safety.

Vladimir Putin: I like what you’re saying, Mr Zatsepin. Certainly, this proposal needs to be analyzed and run by the insurance community and all parties involved.

Dmitry Zatsepin: Most likely, insurers will ask for guarantees that they won’t be overrun by scam artists.

Vladimir Putin: Yes, I understand. That’s why I began with them. We will need to speak with associations of vehicle owners and transport unions. We need to think it over thoroughly. However, I like the idea in general. Thank you for your suggestion.

Is that all, colleagues? I would like to thank you and wish you success at work and at home.

Mikhail Ulitin (deputy chairman of the Altai Territory Retired Interior Officers Council, Colonel (Ret): Mr Putin, I’d like to ask you for a favour on behalf of retired officers here. For us, this is perhaps a unique opportunity …

Vladimir Putin: What is it?

Mikhail Ulitin: A group photo.

Vladimir Putin: Yes, of course, with pleasure. Let’s have a group photo.